First email was sent on the 28th Feb. Last email received was on 5th March. Actually surprised they were that quick in replying.
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Very well put in a calm and professional manor. The likes of NT because they are a large body with funds to match think they can bully the ordinary person. They forgot without the Uk population they would not exist.
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I’m not surprised. With no visitors they have the time to respond to emails, despite blaming covid for their tardiness about actually doing anything about it.
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Other than maintenance staff, the majority will be furloughed except for people like the membership team. According to their emails, the website & drone rules are the responsibility of the Outdoor Activities team and I’d guess they’ll mainly be furloughed.
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I sympathise as I would be keen to fly at many EH/NT sites where I would cause no disturbance to wildlife or people by choosing appropriate times, seasons and places. I am no expert or authority at all, however, I believe these particular organisations had authority granted in their original charters (or whatever the legal name for them is) which allow them to be far more restrictive than any other bodies, apart from security-sensitive organisations, such as the military and AWE.
The argument they no longer have under the new regulations is to differentiate between commercial and non-commercial operators but, I suspect, there is some weasel-wording in their “charters” which gives them some get out clause. Perhaps, if they insist on trying to continue to say that permission has to be sought and plans submitted for every flight, they will be “drowned” in the volume of requests.
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Well done Sir, thank you for taking on a real contentious issue.
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Very well structured letter, Phil.
Just for your interest, this is a reply I got from our local council.
They didn’t bother to ask me what drone I have or what I wanted to do.
Mr Roberts,
Re: Flying Drones,
We do not allow drones to fly over Council due land to Health & Safety issues as it is a Public area and our Public Liability Insurance does not cover such activities.
Thank You,
Malcolm Clough,
Area Landscape Manager
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Thank you for posting this. I doubt they will update anytime soon but it’s good to follow up as well even others like us should.
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Update: I have a submitted a Freedom of Information request asking for copies of their latest and amended constitution and charter. I’m a nosey bugger 
I’ve also had a damn good look through their 1965 bylaws and nowhere does it mention the airspace or skies above their property. In fact it mentions trust land, building, foreshores, rivers, ponds, streams, canals and more but never, not once mentions the skies above or above their properties.
The only time it alludes to the skies is in section 9a Protection of Animals and merely states No unauthorised person shall on Trust Property knowingly take, molest or wilfully disturb, injure, or destroy any living creature or the eggs of any living creature or spread or use any net or set or use any snare or other engine, instrument, lamp, lure or other means for the taking, injury, or destruction of any such living creature or its eggs whether in on or above Trust Property.
You can read the whole thing here if you wish.
National Trust Bylaws.docx (18.5 KB)
I’ve got a rather big bee in my bonnet now
More updates to follow.
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I believe that unless it is stipulated in a local bylaw and clear signs are posted at all entry points to said land it is not enforceable in law. For the council just to say that doesn’t make it so. There has to be either national (CAA) or local legislation prohibiting it. You can get a list of all bylaws currently on the books at the council by submitting a FOI request.
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It’s really interesting that you can get very different replies from adjoining councils.
This is what I got from one of our neighbouring authorities.
Makes you wonder how they decide these things.
Hello Mr Roberts,
I have received your inquiry regards the use of a small drone within Halton. Information surrounding the use of drones is dealt with by the Civil Aviation Agency, see details online at https://www.caa.co.uk/Consumers/Unmanned-aircraft-and-drones/.
According to the website some parts of the Halton do come under the no fly zone for Liverpool John Lennon Airport, though this is mainly around Hale Village. I would suggest that you check the above website to confirm that the drone you wish to use is of the size / type that is allowed to be flown over open parkland.
Kind Regards,
Phillip Wilson
Environmental Health Officer
Public Health Department
Community & Resources Directorate
Halton Borough Council
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This should be the standard response from all councils, referring you to the CAA. 
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@OldSoulBoy Its section 11 (a) of National Trust 1965 byelaws which declares the following
- (a) No unauthorised person shall:
(iii) Ride or drive any conveyance over or upon Trust Property…
Also 11 (b)
It’s the following note that states
“In this byelaw “conveyance” includes any air…”
Plus theyd probably call us out on section 9 aswell
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Do you think BA or Virgin are aware?
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think they’d struggle to approach the pilot.And this is where the terminology of the words comes in. In 1965 this undoubtedly meant a motor vehicle, as in 'drive a motor vehicle. They did not mean piloting an aircraft and they know it. You don’t ‘drive’ a plane in the air. you pilot it. They’ve relied on the exact meaning of the noun and not what they intended for years which is why they’ve never seen the need to apply for it to be updated. They know they couldn’t get any updated bylaw to cover what they wanted it to. Now with the advent of drones and the increasing ownership they are seriously going to have to look at it. If I can see that any barrister worth his salt will too.
On your second point. It’s totally unenforceable. As leehayes alludes to. Height isn’t stipulated so in effect that means to the point where the air runs out. Completely meaningless.
Section 9 is moot. It says on Trust property twice. The airspace above them isn’t their property so it doesn’t apply.
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@OldSoulBoy i don’t disagree with you at all. Just pointing out the sections they’d use against us.
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Very well done Phil. What a ‘cop out’ from herby saying she’ll pass it along and updating the website might take take because of the pandemic. Correct me if I’m wrong but don’t a lot of people work remotely just as efficiently, so why the delay on updating things (or admitting they were wrong). I bet if I was to donate a large sum of money they’d respond ‘shit hot’.
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I would hazard a guess that as with all large organisations it has to go through a myriad of departments and then ultimately be signed off by their legal department. It’s not like you or I updating our websites (that reminds me, not done mine in 18 months!)
Believe me, I’m like a dog with its favourite toy. This is just the start Next step is to bypass their ‘fob off’ departments and correspond directly with their board of governance. A little digging may be required but I’ll get there 
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Those teams have either been on furlough, or they are volunteers and have not been able to do their volunteering for the last year.
The NHS & NTS both use quite a large number of seasonal workers in quite responsible positions and a very large number of them were just about to be taken on when the first lockdown descended and so haven’t done any of their field work (or house work) since then. This does present a bit of a problem as many will have missed their annual refresher training, so will have a bit of catching up on that front before they can get back to doing their jobs again.
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