No-one “owns” air space but CAA & ATC control it and therefore make all decisions. No problem there, the maps etc make it clear where you can fly.
On Public Land your fine unless a local bye law prevents it and it MUST be clearly signed.
Police DO have the right to ask you to land to check your docs - if all ok AND on public land off you go again no problem. You might have to point plod in the direction of the drone regs as from the CAA ( get a link on your phone or tablet - saves time ).
if some jobsworth opens his trap either be polite and point him in the same direction as the plod OR tell him to “go away” and not disturb you as the regs say you must keep line of site.
with National Trust land, so long as you don’t take off or land on their land they can’t do a thing so ignore them, and perhaps explain the situation after you land - again, point them at the CAA regs - they are VERY clear.
I showed a local plod here the regs and after 15 minutes he said “fair enough, thank you for explaining”.
Bottom line is check where you are ( private or public ), check for signage, follow the code and fly !!!
Remember the CAA and NATS want flyers to fly RESPONSIBLY !!! They do help and are always willing to chat on a phone. I phoned Caernarfon runway ATC recently to double check the flight routes up the Menai Straits and they were MOST helpful.
Sorry thats a bit long
Sadly, this is not true. All landowners have property rights to the airspace above their land. The CAA only govern flight safety issues, nothing else, they make this very clear on their website, where they say:
As set out in CAP 722, a CAA permission only addresses the flight safety aspects of the flight operation and does not constitute permission to disregard the legitimate interests of other statutory bodies such as the Police and Emergency Services, Highways England, Data Commission, Transport for London or local authorities. It may also be the case that more than one body has an interest in a proposed flight.
The CAA maps generally only cover areas where there is a flight safety issue with flying. They show where you can’t fly (or need special permission to fly), or where you need to be cautious. They don’t define where you can fly, except for the issues that the CAA control.
Again, this is not really true. There is almost no genuine public land in the UK. Parks, cemeteries and most roads (for example) are private land owned by local councils. Unless it is a Public Right of Way or Public Highway, the council usually has the right to eject you from their land as a trespasser (see here). This is why they have the right to close parks and cemeteries at night - they are legally private land. Byelaws (and also now Public Space Protection Orders) just create an additional criminal offense and the potential to involve the police. There are complications to this depending on the statutory basis on which the council owns the land (see here), but I’m not aware of any basic right of access to publicly-owned land.
I doubt this is true. Police powers allowing them to require you to ground your drone were included in the Air Traffic Management and Unmanned Aircraft Bill (see Schedule 8), which failed to become law last year when Boris closed Parliament and called an election. I assume the reason they were seeking that power is because they don’t currently have it. However, it would always be sensible to follow a reasonable request from the police!
Again, this is not strictly true. The CAA regs only govern flight safety and have nothing to do with NT’s own legal rights, which are in their 1965 bye-laws. Under Bye-law 24, it’s a criminal offence to “disturb” or “annoy” any person present on NT property, which is clearly something flying a drone could do. The NT also have the same rights as any other landowner to raise a civil claim against you for nuisance or trespass if you fly unreasonably low.
I’ve got a whole pile of legal posts drafted to share at some point, but I’ve held back because all this stuff tends just to provoke arguments, and I don’t believe we’ve got any actual lawyers here. Also, you can tie yourself in knots with the legal issues, I think it’s much better just to follow Rear Admiral Grace Murray Hopper’s famous advice:
It is easier to ask forgiveness than it is to get permission.
Just think of this if someone owned airspace above their land then each eirline would need pwrmission to fly over if the CAA are managing the airspace have they permission from the landowner?
There must be no ownership of airspace avoe any land
Everyone owns the air-space above their land. This is why people can’t build bridges above our gardens and so on, it’s commonly referred to as “air rights”. See for example this explanation, which distinguishes between a supposed lower and supposed upper stratum with different property rights, but so far as I can see, the supposed 500-1000 feet boundary quoted there has no real basis in current law. Entry into the air space can be treated as trespass just the same as walking across the land, except that the Civil Aviation Act 1982 s.76(1) gives you the following right to fly over land without trespassing:
No action shall lie in respect of trespass or in respect of nuisance, by reason only of the flight of an aircraft over any property at a height above the ground which, having regard to wind, weather and all the circumstances of the case is reasonable, or the ordinary incidents of such flight, so long as the provisions of any Air Navigation Order and of any orders under section 62 above have been duly complied with
This is why airlines can fly over any land, so long as they maintain a reasonable height. It doesn’t alter property rights, it just confirms a legal right to fly into airspace.
“Reasonable” is not defined, despite the 500-1000 feet figure you read on some websites. I’ve seen in some discussions the suggestion you’re okay if you stay 50m above buildings (as per the Air Navigation Order requirements), but that’s not a legal defence against trespass, that’s just compliance with CAA permissions.
Thanks Ian, I’d just be cautious as that seems to be from an American source (the Dummies guide to Property Law). I tend to just take the common-sense view when I’m flying: stay high above occupied properties and land so as not to cause a nuisance, and fly lower if I need to over unoccupied properties and land.
South Stack is indeed awesome but complicated. Sometimes NATS has it as a “Caution” area, and sometimes the DJI app gives me a red “No Takeoff Possible” message !!!??? Perhaps due to the RAF at Valley but I’ve never seen jets come thundering in from that angle over the stack. RSPB has it red flagged at nesting time obviously so a lot of research needs to go in, with some local info before firing the drone up on the headland. Its on my list too, just waiting for the right conditions. Will post photos & vid when I get airborne there.
Its a fine spot all round really - sunrise is indeed excellent but its THE place if your into astro photography too - star trails over the lighthouse but it gets busy. So long as you don’t fly over Puffin Island in nesting season its fine. From there up the east coast is great flying and very quiet too so no miserable bar stewards about or RAF !!!
